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Forum Home > Guitar For Beginners & Beyond General Forum > The Workings Of Music > Circle of 5ths, in theory?


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Old December 15th, 2005
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missileman missileman is offline
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Circle of 5ths, in theory?

In explaining the circle of 5ths I have heard and seen it written that the circle goes to 7 flats or 7 sharps. Is that correct?
If it is, does anything more than 5 flats or sharps have any practicle application outside of theory?
If so could someone please explain.


Jim
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Old December 15th, 2005
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Kirk Lorange Kirk Lorange is offline
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Neilsonite??

You know, I've been hearing about the circle of fifths all my life, I know what it is, what it sounds like, but not once have I ever needed to refer to it in terms of 'how many sharps or flats'!

I think it's all a notation issue, the #s and bs ... so that you never wind up with two of the same letter, so you wind with B#s or Cbs, but James will be able to give the definitive answer, I'm sure.


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Old December 16th, 2005
Neilsonite Neilsonite is offline
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Hi, basically you're right, keys with that many accidentals are avoided...

If you look at the 'sharp keys' in increasing number of sharps (from 1 to 7), we have:
- G (1), D (2), A (3), E (4), B (5), F# (6), C# (7)

If you look at the 'flat keys' in increasing number of flats (from 1 to 7), we have:
- F (1), Bb (2), Eb (3), Ab (4), Db (5), Gb (6), Cb (7)

So, if you look at the keys with 7 accidentals (C# and Cb)...

- the key of C# (with 7 sharps) has the same notes as Db (5 flats), so Db is generally preferred
- the key of Cb (with 7 flats) has the same notes as B (5 sharps), so B is generally preferred

The keys of F# (6 sharps) and Gb (6 flats) have the same number of accidentals, and both contain annoying notes (E# and Cb respectively), so neither is really preferred, they both suck equally!

So, all the keys can be used, but for those with 7 accidentals (C# and Cb), enharmonic keys with fewer accidentals are used if possible.

Anyway, I would argue that this only really affects people reading standard notation, so for most guitarists it's not something to worry about. The circle of 5ths/4ths can be useful in practicing things in all keys, and in generating chord progressions, but I think that the easiest way for guitarists to learn their keys is to apply the shape of the major scale, and work out the notes that way. I'll be posting a lesson on it soon...

Hope that answers your question,
James

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Old December 16th, 2005
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It sure did, Thank you so much.


Jim
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Forum Home > Guitar For Beginners & Beyond General Forum > The Workings Of Music > Circle of 5ths, in theory?


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