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Behringer UB802 vs. Xenyx 802

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Lcjones    8
Dude... the manual is about as indepth as the back of a shampoo bottle. :thumbdown It's litterally no help at all. I went to the Behringer site to look for further instructions but that wasn't real helpful either.

...and that is exactly where Behringer is lacking .....

**

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WernHalen    0

Ok I had a look at the site It does not look like the unit has any assignable buttons or anything... I think you might have a dud. Take it back to the store and have them look at it. All the tracks should work and there should not be any noise.

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WernHalen    0

I agree Les, the quality you get fro the price is worth the difficulty IMHO... If you know your way around mixers it is not too difficult to learn how each of the behringers work.

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powe6563    0
I think you might have a dud. Take it back to the store and have them look at it. All the tracks should work and there should not be any noise.

Yeah that's what i am afraid of too. I am going to try the fx send connection first but if that doesnt make a difference I guess I'm driving 30 miles back to Guitar Center:censored:

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WernHalen    0

I just thought about it now... have you turned the gains on the different channels up and down? Channel one might not be working cause the gain is too low and the unit might be humming cause the gain on the 2nd channel is too high... :dunno:

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powe6563    0

Well I played with the gains and all the other levels a bit. That did help to lower the hum a lot but it's still there and the #1 channel is still not working so I'm just gonna take it back and exchange it.

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fly135    5

You should use "Main Mix" to the computer "Line In". If you want to record the computer is playing along with your own guitar/vocal then run the computer "Line out" to UB802 "Tape In" or one of the stereo mixer inputs. The advatange of "Tape In" is that you can switch the computer in and out easily with the "tape to mix" button.

Turn down all gain controls on your unused "low level" inputs (the ones with DIN connectors). Also turn down the mixer volume controls on unused inputs.

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Tekker    1
Thanks Tekker! I am going to try going through the fx/aux send to the sound card, but i've noticed that there is a lot of buzz and hum wven when I'm not hooked up to the computer. :confused: I can hear it through the headphones even if I don't plug in a mic or a guitar, and the 1st channel doesn't seem to work either! :brickwall: I got it brand new yesterday from guitar center so i don't want to take it back if these are operator errors. Anyone had any similar problems?:surrender

Sorry, I didn't see your post before. You and WernHalen both responded while I was typing and I never saw that you had replied.

Behringers are known for being noisy. When my Behringer's volume controls are set at 0dB with the gain is less than half way up there is a pretty good amount of noise. Mine is an older mixer, but the one I use at church for my headphones is brand new and isn't much better. Without being there to hear it, it's hard to tell if it's just normal noise or if the noise is abnormally loud.

Turn the gain and volume faders down on all of the channels then set one of the channel's volume fader at 0dB and the master fader at 0dB and start turning up the gain until you hear the signal. Is it still really noisy?

I don't know what to suggest for the bad channel, if you can get the others working then you should be able to repeat the same steps and get the first channel working. So it's not likely a setup issue and you probably have a dud. :thumbdown

-tkr

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Tekker    1
You should use "Main Mix" to the computer "Line In". If you want to record the computer is playing along with your own guitar/vocal then run the computer "Line out" to UB802 "Tape In" or one of the stereo mixer inputs. The advatange of "Tape In" is that you can switch the computer in and out easily with the "tape to mix" button.

Do you send the "Tape In" coming from the computer to the main mix or to the control room? If you send what's coming out of the computer to the main mix and the main mix is plugged into the computer, then you are sending what's coming out of the computer right back into the computer which will create a feedback loop.

Looking at a picture of the UB802, it has the option to send the tape in to the control room separately from the main ouputs. Pluggin the speakers into the control room and sending the tape in to the control room only wouldn't cause the feedback loop.

How do you have yours setup?

Turn down all gain controls on your unused "low level" inputs (the ones with DIN connectors).

Mixer's don't have DIN connectors (DIN is generally used for MIDI and keyboards), the connectors on the mixer look kind of similiar to DIN connectors but are called 'XLR'.

-tkr

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Lcjones    8

....don't know if you got things working or not but just another thought.....

Your guitar is mono. The Behringer is basically mono. The 802 main outs have Left & Right jacks that create the stereo effect. (Left/Right Channel) You will need two patch cables from the Console Main Outs to a Dual Mono 1/4" to Single Stereo 1/8" adapter to the LineIn on the soundcard.

If you are using a single patch cable from the console to the sound card or a mono 1/8 to the LineIn on the sound card you will only get one channel.

.... that is if you are talking channels as being Left & Right.....

..... those who know more than me please correct if that thought is wrong.....

Thanks

Les

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Tekker    1
Your guitar is mono. The Behringer is basically mono. The 802 main outs have Left & Right jacks that create the stereo effect. (Left/Right Channel) You will need two patch cables from the Console Main Outs to a Dual Mono 1/4" to Single Stereo 1/8" adapter to the LineIn on the soundcard.

If you are using a single patch cable from the console to the sound card or a mono 1/8 to the LineIn on the sound card you will only get one channel.

In the case of a mono signal, if you use one cable off of the left mixer output, it will be the same as using two cables since the signal is identical in both. The only difference is you'll get a little more volume using both the left and right outputs since you have two of the same signal being added together. If that makes any sense. lol :D

Basically, when using mono signals with no panning, it doesn't make much difference.

-tkr

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Tekker    1

On a side note, I just caught an error in my tutorial that I mentioned earlier.

I was thinking that the aux sends were stereo and they are in fact mono (just tested it). It's been a long time since I've used the mixer to send anything to the computer and I had forgotten the aux sends weren't stereo. So I've made a few modifications to the tutorial. If you are only working with mono signals, the aux send is still the best way to send tracks to the computer (due to the separate volume controls from the volume faders). But if you are working with stereo sources using a stereo output like the main mix or headphone outputs are a better option. :winkthumb:

-tkr

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powe6563    0

Ok, so I finally just accepted that I had a dud and went back to guitar center yesterday to exchange the mixer. They were out of UB802's so I got the Xenyx 802 instead. Every thing is working perfctly now!:yeahhh: No hum, all the channels I paid for and it's much cooler in black.

By the way, RA IN, I asked the tech guy at guitar center what the difference was b/t the UB and the Xenyx models and he said that basically they are the same. The Xenyx model is replacing the UB model and the only real noticable difference is the way the EQ is set up. They supposedly improved on it in the Xenyx model. That being said, I don't see a problem with buying the UB802 for 20 bucks less, that is if you get one that works! The tech guy didn't seem to think the difference was significant. The only problem I could forsee would be that they are discontinuing the UB version so you may have trouble getting parts or tech support for it soon.

Tekker,

I had a Dyn mic via XLR in channel 1, My guitar going through my ZOOM effects box into channel 2, the FX send going to my Line six Spider II 15 on the clean setting with some reverb added for vocals and then from the amp back into the aux return on the mixer. Then I went from tape out to line in on the computer and plugged in headphones on the mixer to monitor it all. It works really well. I have the vocals on channel one sending through the FX to the amp for reverb, and the guitar going strait to the main out/tape out... It worked well with no feedback or buzz but i cant seem to get the levels right between the guitar and vocals. When I am recording in Audacity, if I start singing first it sounds good but when I start to play along the guitar overtakes the vocals and peaks, but If I play the guitar first then it's fine and the vocals overtake it and peak. What am I doing wrong? They each sound good alone but when I try to do both one or the other keeps trying to be dominant. It does it even when I turn them both down low too.

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WernHalen    0

Are you monitoring one track from your computer? If so then, what happens is probably this...

You are recording one track onto the computer in audacity. Then you play back that same track into the mixer to give yourself a monitor of what is going on. While recording the second track you are actually recording the first track again.

Check to see if the track that you are using for the computer is not sending to the mains/tape output... ot something like that. :dunno:

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WernHalen    0

Listen to eash of the two tracks that you just recorded individually... Do they sound normal or can you hear both the voice and the guitar on the second track?

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powe6563    0
Listen to eash of the two tracks that you just recorded individually... Do they sound normal or can you hear both the voice and the guitar on the second track?

Umm...Well, I'm only recording a single track, vocals and guitar at the same time. I don't know how to record multiple separate tracks at the same time with audacity. Is that possible cause it would be much better/easier that way?

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fly135    5

"If you send what's coming out of the computer to the main mix and the main mix is plugged into the computer, then you are sending what's coming out of the computer right back into the computer which will create a feedback loop."

The only time there is a feedback loop is when you are using what some sound cards call "record what you hear". In general what the computer puts out can be kept separate from what it's recording.

powe6563, unfortunately I can't reminder who posted the link here at GFB&B but there is an article on a web site that discusses the problem of recording guitar and vocals and the washing out effect. Basically the solution to your problem in realtime rather than in post processing is to get a multiband EQ and notch out the guitar in the frequencies that are of interest for your vocals. What they are and how much to attenutate is up for experimentation. If I can find the link I will post it here.

Good, I was still in time to edit this post....

http://www.guitarforbeginners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5671

It's the "recording guitar and vocals" thread in this section of the forum. Check out the "linkage". It will give the whole story.

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fly135    5

"I don't know how to record multiple separate tracks at the same time with audacity"

You can put the vocals on the left channel and the guitar on the right. I'm pretty sure your mixer is stereo. My UB1200FX is stereo. Then in audacity you can split the stereo into two mono tracks and monkey with it. You could also perform the band (notch) filtering on the guitar.

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Tekker    1
"If you send what's coming out of the computer to the main mix and the main mix is plugged into the computer, then you are sending what's coming out of the computer right back into the computer which will create a feedback loop."

The only time there is a feedback loop is when you are using what some sound cards call "record what you hear". In general what the computer puts out can be kept separate from what it's recording.

You don't have to be recording for the type of loop I was talking. When you plug the mixer into the line input, you should be able to hear this without recording. Plugging the output from the computer into the tape in and sending that to the main output (which goes back into the computer) is what creates the feedback loop.

Unless you have the line input muted on your soundcard, this would also keep it from coming back into the mixer but you can still record it.

-tkr

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fly135    5

Tekker, what you are saying is true. You can setup a loop, but I generally don't monitor the output of my mixer through my computer speakers. But I do record the output of the computer mixed with my guitar/vocals..

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Tekker    1
"I don't know how to record multiple separate tracks at the same time with audacity"

You can put the vocals on the left channel and the guitar on the right. I'm pretty sure your mixer is stereo. My UB1200FX is stereo. Then in audacity you can split the stereo into two mono tracks and monkey with it. You could also perform the band (notch) filtering on the guitar.

Yep, the mixer is stereo, so that should do it. :thumbup1:

Sounds like the vocal/guitar thing is because the vocals and the guitar are in the same frequency range. These have a tendency to "step on each other" a bit. Where raising one will cause it to mask out the other. If you can't get the volume adjusted right so they will blend together, then you'll have to use EQ to cut certain frequencies in one track and boost those same frequencies in the other track in each track in order to make them blend better. There was a great site posted a few threads down that had very cool charts that displayed this technique very well.

http://www.homerecordingconnection.com/news.php?action=view_story&id=154

-tkr

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Tekker    1
Tekker, what you are saying is true. You can setup a loop, but I generally don't monitor the output of my mixer through my computer speakers. But I do record the output of the computer mixed with my guitar/vocals..

The loop occurs without the speakers too. Unless you stop what's coming into the soundcard from going back out and into the mixer (because the mixer's main outputs are going back into the soundcard) then you will get the feedback loop.

So somehow you must be stopping the sound from coming back out of the line input. Either the line in's playback volume is turned off or it is muted. It could even be that the line input's playback volume is down low enough that it doesn't create a noticable amount of feedback.

-tkr

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powe6563    0
You can put the vocals on the left channel and the guitar on the right. I'm pretty sure your mixer is stereo. My UB1200FX is stereo. Then in audacity you can split the stereo into two mono tracks and monkey with it. You could also perform the band (notch) filtering on the guitar.

That's a good idea about panning them over to opposite sides, I'll try that this afternoon. What is band notch filtering?

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