[justinthyme]

Hi guys.

From the get-go I taught myself to play with economy picking (eg an up-pick on the B string will carry into another up-pick on the G string).

However, I see and read a lot of lessons where great emphasis is put on STRICT up-down-up-down picking - which seems to me counterproductive as it slows things down.

My question is - is there some particular importance to practicing with the strict UDUD method? Or is this a stage you pass through before learning economy picking? I ask because I am going back to basics and don't want to learn to use UDUD only to have to go back to the economy style. Hope that makes sense.

Cheers ...

Ian

[allthumbs]

Economy picking is certainly more intuitive. The strict up and down picking is a more classical approach. I have never read of anyone stating either one is wrong. I would go with what is most comfortable for you.

[justinthyme]

Makes sense, AT.

[scotty_b]

I am an advocate of alternate picking, for the advantages it offers to articulation and rhythm. I believe it offers far more expression to the player. A listen to Al Di Meola will show what is possible with alternate picking. Try this clip
YouTube - Mediterranean Sundance - Guitar Trio: Al Di Meola
John McLaughin also uses strict alternate picking. Steve Morse, John Petrucci and Paul Gilbert also use that approach exlusively.

[justinthyme]

Good link, scotty. Great playing. Pretty sure I saw some economy picking in there - or would that be sweep picking? All up-picks at around the 68 second mark?

Anyway - could you expand on why alternate picking would be advantageous to articulation and rhythm? Crisper attack or something? Might be a hard one to put down in words - but I'd really be interested in your futher thoughts on this.

Cheers.

Ian

[scotty_b]

Sure Ian
Several upstrokes in a row would be sweep-picking.
Economy picking takes something from that, in that the idea is to move directly to the next string. I used to be an economy picker, had developed that in high school, mainly because I found it easier, and could see no reason to change.
When I started studying music after school, one of my first tutors discussed the pros and cons of the whole thing - and I changed then. It took a while, as I had several years of playing the other way under my belt by then.
I found that moving directly to another string tended to make the notes all blur into one another. Moving to alternate picking - down on the beat, up off the beat - enabled me to create greater distinction. I found it also encompassed greater dynamic possibilities - I think Larry Carlton is one of the finest players in this regard.
In terms of greater rhythmic control, I found that after some time working on it, I could sense when to play up or down, according to whether the note fell on the beat or not.
It took a lot of work for me to get that right, and undo a lot of other things in my playing that were causing me all sorts of grief.
At the moment I am really examing my technique again - I want to be able to make the notes pop out of the guitar when I start playing fast. I am able to get fairly good volume when I move up a gear or two - and I have really found the past 6 months or so my fingers can really fly - but I want to be able to sound like Al Di Meola on his acoustic. It sounds like he good bust a string at any moment.
I will also qualify all of this by saying that it really depends on what you want to play. BB King plays mainly downstrokes to really dig into the notes. I think Hendrix really did whatever he felt like at the time, but there were not many runs or complex picking passages in his music either.
I think with all things, it is good to determine what you want from the guitar, and then move forward from there. I strongly encourage people to be able to articulate why that are going with a particular approach. There are pros and cons to almost everything, but being able to identify those and then make a decision is important as we move forward as players. Those people who go 'I just bash through it/play whatever causes the least amount of pain/ this is easy, I don't like hard work' will generally be playing the same way in a year, 2 years, 5 years.

[justinthyme]

Good answer, scotty - much appreciated as always.

Right now I'm using the 'spider' finger exercise and those provided by tekker elsewhere in the forum ... and they provide the ideal opportunity to be strict with the alternate picking. No gain without 'pain'

Cheers

Ian

[Rockerbob]

I just try my best to get to the right note. Usually, I think I use pretty straight up and down.