[Berto]

Ok, bare with me while I explain:

I'd thought the guitar was on it's last legs and had some things wrong with it for while, but I was unable to pinpoint a real problem until now. I think the reason I've found the problem is because I started learning all the notes on the strings and experimenting higher up the frets to see if I could name the notes.

And thus the problem showed itself: It's playing the wrong notes as I go further up the frets

I noticed because the high e and the b string sounded perfectly in tune when playing 5th fret in the B string and open e, but if I'm right in thinking it should also sound in tune playing the 13th fret on the B and the 8th fret on the e, then my guitars not right because it sounds disgracefuly untuned

I might sound a bit daft for only now noticing, but what the hell. Anyone know why this might be happening? I've noticed that at the nut of the guitar the strings are really close to the board, but by the 12th fret they are much further away, at least a quarter inch I'd say.
Sound like a fixable problem or is it new guitar time?

Sorry for the long post, and for being far too low in guitar knowledge (haha) but I'm hoping one of you guys will have an answer of some sort. Thanks in advance

[allthumbs]

I am assuming this is an acoustic. Hold the guitar in front of your eyes horizontally. Do you see the wood around the bridge bulging up instead of being flat. Does it look like the back of the bridge is higher than the front? All those are signs that a guitar has sat too long under tension, unplayed. Sometimes if it is not too far gone, a truss rod adjustment and shaving the bridge will save it. You would have to take it to a shop and have it assessed.
The two notes in your last example should both be the C note so, yes you have a problem.

[Berto]

No it's not an acoustic, sorry I should have explained more about the guitar setup in the original post.

It's a cheap old fender strat copy, with a tremolo bridge (arm removed many years ago). The bridge itself seems completely level looking down the guitar.

I've been trying to read through threads about intonation and adjusting the bridge etc. just to see if I could find any info that sounded relevant, and after reading a few things I checked the string saddles on the bridge, and they look in bad shape. Some lean up, some down, while the high e strings saddle is noticeably lower than the rest, with the screws sticking up in the air like they want to get out.

So it seems that whatever else is wrong with it, that's certainly going to be a big problem for the intonation. Now I'm just trying to find the right instrument to adjust them with, they don't really look like screws at all, just hollow black plastic casings.

As you can tell, I've never been mechanically or techincally minded, so this is all a bit difficult for me to work out. I hope this additional info sheds a bit more light on the problem.

[allthumbs]

You might be describing an allen key. It should be fixable. It just needs to be intonated and the string height set using the saddle adjustment and the truss rod.

[Noodler]

Allthumbs,

What do you think of checking the intonation by seeing if the harmonic at the 12fret and the note at the 12th fret match?

[allthumbs]

Sure. Then fret the 12th fret and then play it open. It should all sound the same.

[doug russell]

Hi Berto and welcome, sounds like you need your guitar set up. All good guitar shops will do it for you, about £25-45 depends on the shop. or look in the yellow pages.. The prices for a set vary quite a lot. But I reckon the problem is very fixable.

[Stratrat]

Originally Posted by doug russell

Hi Berto and welcome, sounds like you need your guitar set up. All good guitar shops will do it for you, about £25-45 depends on the shop. or look in the yellow pages.. The prices for a set vary quite a lot. But I reckon the problem is very fixable.

+1. From your description, it sounds like the intonation is screwed up and somebody mis-adjusted your saddle height screws, and the truss rod may need a bit of a tweak. If that's all it is, a shop should be able to fix it in a half-hour or so. If you ask real nice, they may even let you watch while they do it and explain the process to you, so that you could learn how to do it yourself in the future.

[Jomi]

If there's a big gap below the strings at the 12th fret then you will have to bend and therefore stretch them further in order to fret them. This means that the string is temporarily longer than usual (while you press)and explains why it will sound progressively more out tune as you go up the neck. A truss rod adjustment should correct this and you can try it yourself by following a few instructions, there's a good description of how this is done here:
Adjusting A Truss Rod on You Guitar, Bass, Mandolin - What is it? How do I check relief? How do I adjust the rod properly?

[fly135]

Berto, everyone here has touched on the possible problems. Electrics are pretty easy to adjust. You can raise and lower the saddles to adjust string height. As Jomi mentioned you may need a truss rod adjustment as this also affects string height and fret buzzing issues.

Lastly, is this guitar stock? The distance from the nut to the 12th fret should be the same as the distance from the 12th fret to the bridge saddle. If someone replaced the neck with a different scale length then the intonation problems will be more difficult to fix.

Tune each string open. If the 12th fret note is pitched high then adjust the bridge saddle screw to pull the saddle bakc and lengthen the string. Do the opposite if the pitch at the 12th is too low.

[Berto]

Thanks for the tips guys, I have no idea about the set up as it was bought many years ago and was second hand. So coupled with the fact that I am literally useless at anything that involves precision with tools or fixing things, I've been very wary of trying to make my own adjustments.

But from what you've said it does sound like it could be fixed at a low price, so I'm going to hang on to it and get it done soon, I might ask them to replace the strings with high gauge as well, because I've just bought a new guitar and I'll use the bad old Hohner as an alternative tuning "mess around" guitar when it's fixed and set up properly.

Sounds like a good plan

[krissovo]

Make sure you get the new one setup as well

[Berto]

Originally Posted by krissovo

Make sure you get the new one setup as well

Yeah, I'll have to do that to avoid it turning into something like the Hohner over time.