[denyyourmaker]

Hi

Ive just picked up the guitar again after 3 years of not playing. I played for 10 years previous to that.

Thing is, a lot has changed since then and i can now afford better gear. Not top line, but better than previously.

I bought an Ibanez RG2EX1 and put a set of EMG 81/85s in it. Sounds much better, but not as good as it did in the shop! So i reckon its my amp (crappy little Dean Markley practice amp).

So what i want to know is, what kind of amp to look at? I play predominantly Metal. Im in a Metal covers band and have shows coming up from July. So it needs to be loud.
What's the difference between tube and valve? Does the cab need to match the head? What difference do the speakers make? (ive been advised to look for Celestion?) Are ALL Marshall stacks/half stacks good quality?
Ive been looking at various ones but want to get some advise before shelling out. My budget is $500-$800ish.

Many thanks in advance!!!

[JREC]

Tube and Valve are the North American and British name for the same thing. Tubes are generally more "vintage" sounding than solid state, though IMO with either type and the right pups/fx you can get pretty close to any sound you're going for. Sadly I'm not into metal so I'm not really sure what the best bet for you would be--Marshalls generally are both very loud and good quality, though you're paying a lot for the name and could get an amp that sounds just as good but with a different name on it for a lot cheaper...just my opinion of course

[Noodler]

Since replies seem slow and you may be in a hurry, I'll give you some clues you might want to look into about your stack to help you research.

You don't have to run a Marshall speaker box with your head, but you do need to check the ohm rating (impedence) of the speaker cab. Too low an impedence can blow your amp, because it expects more resistance. Running a tube amp without a speaker attached (ie no load) will blow it immediately. Check this, but I think you are OK to run a box with a higher impedence than your amp expects. So if your amp has an 8 ohm out, I think a 16 ohm cab is OK, but a 4 ohm isn't. Can someone verify that?

With speakers you get what you pay for as a rule. Better speakers are more expensive, plain and simple. So you often see two models of the same amp, but one with upgraded speakers. Yes, Celestion are classics. Other words you'll hear in the "good" department are Jensen, Greenback (a type of Celestion), Alnico Blue (also Celestion). Yes, your average Marshall quad box will have Celestions.
Here's a good summary link:

Retro Sound Amp Co.

The main thing about speakers, to me anyway, is their size. A 12" moves a lot of air. You'll feel those babies. You just need to make sure you get 10" or preferably 12" speakers. 8" is for practice, 15" is for bass alone.

No, not all Marshall stacks are good quality. We all kind of grew up with them at their peak I reckon. But there is so much different opinion. Check out Harmony Central for frank, often brutal reviews of gear. eg Did you know that they make solid state half-stacks? I'm not saying there's anything wrong with them, just that I'll bet they're not what you were thinking of!
Harmony Central®: Marshall Offers Limited Edition 100W MG Half Stack

Marshalls generally are both very loud and good quality, though you're paying a lot for the name and could get an amp that sounds just as good but with a different name on it for a lot cheaper...just my opinion of course

I agree with this. If I was going for a Marshall half-stack, I'd expect to do a lot of research and spend a lot more than you have budgeted for.

I'll be very interested to see what others reckon on this one.

[Stratrat]

I haven't pitched in because I don't play metal and don't know enough about the hi-gain amps (especially in the budget region) to contribute much. I know that Soldano and the EVH 5150 amps (I think Fender's making them now) are renowned high-gainers, as are Krank - but all those are outside the OP's budget. About the only suggestion I could come up with would be the Vox AD50VTX - it's a modeler that's patterned after more high-gain amps than the original AD50VT.

Personally, I'd stay away from solid-state Marshalls. I haven't played one but I've heard plenty of them being played (evvv-err-yyy time I go into a GC!), and I can't say I'm impressed with the tone at all (again - YMMV, as I'm not a metal player). Most of the reviews I've read say the same type of things about them. To get that "classic" Marshall sound, you'd be looking at their tube (valve) heads, which are considerably higher on the food chain price-wise!

Speakers are such a deep subject that one could almost write a book about them. There are many varieties made by many manufacturers, and lots of them have different sounds - aimed more at the "British" sound, or the "American" sound, or whatever. Speaker efficiency ratings can make a huge difference in how loud an amp is - a 102 dB rated speaker is much more efficient than one rated 97dB, and can make more (apparent) difference than doubling your amp's wattage! For example, the Eminence Tonker (rated 102 dB) is considered by many guys as being a brutally loud speaker. Some have tried them in their amps and discovered that they were too efficient, as it made the amp too loud to play in the "sweet spot" without blowing everybody's ears out.

[Noodler]

I've never heard anyone say anything bad about the Vox Valvetronix, and from memory, the 50W AD50VT has an upgraded speaker too.

Here's a video demo of the XL (high-gain) version stratrat is talking about:

YouTube - video review vox valvetronix advt-xl amp rob math

I actually like the normal one better, even for metal:

Vox Valvetronix AD30VT | Gearwire

YouTube - Vox AD50VT US HiGain

Sersly, at your price-range you might be better off looking for something like the Vox, or even a Line 6, Bugera (which is real valve), etc. Nothing wrong with wanting a classic Marshall half-stack, but you'd be looking at I think 3-4 times what you want to pay. People want the good models, so even old beaten-up ones are similar in price to brand new ones (check e-bay).

Here's what I think you were after. Hold your breath before looking at the price, and remember, this is just the head, no speakers:

Buy Marshall Vintage Modern 2466 Tube Amp Head online at Musician's Friend

[Stratrat]

Originally Posted by Noodler

...Sersly, at your price-range you might be better off looking for something like the Vox, or even a Line 6, Bugera (which is real valve), etc...

Just keep in mind that Bugera is made by Behringer (for whatever that's worth).

[JessThrasher]

I have a thread on buying amps. Theres lots of useful information. Check it out!

[Noodler]

Link hermanli? Sheesh.

[JessThrasher]

http://www.guitarforbeginners.com/fo...guide-jessica/

[Noodler]

Thankyou, come again.


hey I used to struggle to write your name, but now I get it! Herman Li, the Ibanez Shredder from Dragonforce.

I'll check out the link.

Interesting that Orange's Tiny Terror has heaps of gain, but doesn't do metal. So metal isn't all about gain. I'll be interested in what you've got to say.

[79Lespaul]

NoBrainer Decision...Marshall Head and Cabinate!

[Noodler]

79 LesPaul, quote from the OP, mate:

My budget is $500-$800ish.

[Stratrat]

Huh? From what little I've heard, the Orange Tiny Terror is a fairly high-gain amp....why wouldn't it do metal? ANY amp will do metal with the right pedal in front of it.

I tend toward clean(ish) amps, and use pedals to get more dirt. Unless you're a full-on, 100% of the time drowned-in-distortion metalhead, that's the way to go IMO. You can add dirt to a clean amp, but you can't add clean to a dirty (i.e. ultra-high gain) amp.

[Noodler]

YouTube - Orange Tiny Terror Metal

You can make up your own mind, but even with Chappers playing it, it still would not be my first choice for metal, and it can't do clean at high volume. It's designed to do one thing well.

I tend toward clean(ish) amps, and use pedals to get more dirt. Unless you're a full-on, 100% of the time drowned-in-distortion metalhead, that's the way to go IMO. You can add dirt to a clean amp, but you can't add clean to a dirty (i.e. ultra-high gain) amp.

From what I'm finding out, this isn't always right. For instance metal amps have speakers that sit better with distortion. The Eminences in a Fender Hotrod Deluxe just won't suit that style as well as others. Also the 6L6's in Fenders also don't like distortion very much, even if it comes from pedals. I think there is a place for high-gain genre-specific amps, and that for metal-only that can mean solid state.

The Tiny Terror is a sweet amp, but not for metal, nor for 60's surf rock, IMHO. But what I do agree with is using pedals to get the sound, and as such you don't necessarily need valves. I have gotten fully authentic metal tones to die for out of practice amps with pedals.

[Noodler]

Most heads I'm seeing have switchable impedences to match different cabs. eg Switchable 8 or 16 ohm.

denyyourmaker, have you been shopping?