[hb]

I would like to have some opinions if one wanted a guitar that sounded like (or kinda like) a telecaster, but didn't want to spend that much money, what would you buy.
Thanks in advance,
hb

[Stratrat]

HB - I was in the same boat as you, wanting a Tele but not wanting to spend the $$$ for a "true" Telecaster. I found a nicely made Squier Tele at Guitar Center for $169 and snapped it up. As Allthumbs said, build quality for Squiers can be all over the board, so it's best if you can actually sit down and play the guitar before plunking your money down, to make sure you're getting a good one.

The Squier '51 that Allthumbs mentioned is a good choice also. I just got mine and haven't played it much yet, but you can get a pretty Tele-ish sound out of it (along with several other sounds, due to the pickup configuration and switching arrangement), and it was only $99. I bought mine through mail order and it has some minor issues that can easily be fixed through a good setup, but others have apparently gotten some real lemons. Again, as above - it would be best if you could find a local store that has them in stock so you could examine it thoroughly and play it before buying.

Neither of the above are "high-end" guitars - but they play plenty well enough and the price is right. As Das Alt Peruke said, the guitar along won't make you sound like <insert artist of your choice here> - it's a combination of the instrument, the amp, your playing ability/style, and any effects they might use. I don't sound like Eddie Van Halen or Eric Clapton on my strat, I don't sound like Brad Paisley on my Tele, and I don't sound like.....uhhhhhh, whoever.....on my '51.

[zeater41]

Bottom Line any guitar Tele or Arc or Whatever will get it's sound from your hands! You can try to emulate any style/sound with the right equipment. Lukather on his website states: "That no matter how hard you try you can't sound like me because you do not have my hands, feel, touch, rig" "Thanks I guess it's flattering" Just woodshed!

What Style of Music do you play? What Budget? Onece you dive in and purchase your Squier 51, Tele, Hondo Les Paul, Whatever? You would be a moron not to figure in a good technician setting it up anyway! Lot's of stores throw that in, in a purchase...WELL WORTH the $$$ no matter what.

I got a first generation Squier Strat and they tell me it is the 1975 Strat tightened up and made not in America, so maybe I got lucky.

"All over the place Squier 51's can probably be set-up nicely with the right tech! And Provide Years of Enjoyment! When you do that, talk to the tech and provide a fresh set of strings...You cannot go wrong!"

I happen to Live 8 minutes from Chuck Levin's/Washington Music Center and their tech is Rob, (He set up a 1987 Jackson Dinky, Midnight Purple Lightning Strike Mural that I have with Seymour Duncan Kneck: JB Jr, Middle: Cool Rails and the Bridge: Duncan Invader. We discussed every facet of every facet...we took that guitar from Hot to WHITE HOT, plus it is pristine and made in the original plant in California not Texas...Some great value there, he wants to buy it, it is not for sale...Make sure you keep all original parts if you do something like that even on low end stuff) we consult on every angle I am thinking about doing to any guitar...We have created the luxuries I want on my guitars. You would do well to do that on any purchase even low end to make your playing experince enjoyable...You will play longer and better!

Enough already...DIVE IN! Tell us how it turns out!

[hb]

I kinda know what you're talking about in a vague form, but please describe to me in detail what all is incorporated in "setting up" a guitar. Would one "set up" a guitar different for one buyer than another?
thanks,
hb

[allthumbs]

Most setups consist of adjusting the truss rod for maximum playability. Intonation if needed and checking the nut and hardware for flaws. It costs from 30 to 50 bucks. If you got a squire51 or any inexpensive guitar that needed the edges of the fret wires filed, not uncommon, then it would cost more. There are instructions in the guitar tech forum for how to do all this yourself. You can see that if there are problems with a cheap guitar that you can't fix yourself, you can run into extra costs which negate the bargain price.

[zeater41]

Originally Posted by hb

I kinda know what you're talking about in a vague form, but please describe to me in detail what all is incorporated in "setting up" a guitar. Would one "set up" a guitar different for one buyer than another?
thanks,
hb

Great question...Set Up means the distance the strings are from the fretboard (String Height) easier to play or harder to play) then you may be in tune to yourself but when you go to play with others there would need to be the ability to tune together to concert pitch which is 440hz or standard "A" tuning. Most Rock players play in 430hz which is commonly called "E flat" Half step lower than 440 "E"

Set Up or Intonation is dealing with string length. If you change strings, from the original brand on the guitar you should always check the intonation. When you buy the guitar find out what brand is on there, most times you can stay with that brand and skip a setup if it feels all right! When you change string gauges .09 High E or .010 High E (Heavier...Harder to bend, stays in tune more, gain more tone) can affect whether you are "Intonated" correctly to play in tune with other guitarists (Heavier Strings Affect Pressure on the Neck)...Look at it as a "Standard" it is extremely important.

The "Set Up" deals with your personal preference's on how the guitar plays or feels. It is best left to a professional with experience or good friend who knows what they are doing might do it for free. In my neck of the woods it's about $60-$100; well worth it! The Floyd Rose Tremolo (Wang Bar) makes it costly.

Bottom line; Necessary to play in tune with other musicians, sets a standard, should be done about every six months depending on how much you play, what conditions your guitar experience's, (Weather is huge) cold goes sharp, heat goes flat. usually it is wood and wood reacts to weather changes...always when you travel to play with someone else, open your case in the room at least a half hour/20 mins. minimum before you go to tune! "Acclimate" the guitar to the room/venue. Never leave your guitar in EXTREME Heat or Cold Especially Heat! IT Can absolutely RUIN your Guitar!

Sorry to be redundant; in reveiw, Height of strings to fretboard, length of strings from "Nut" to bridge, gauge of strings all affect setup...think of it as your comfort level of playing and how your guitar/hands feel after you are done. Easy to play like Butter or difficult to play...it can be adjusted to your likes and needs. They usually don't have to adjust the "Truss Rod" like someone in the forum mentioned; if so maybe you bought the wrong guitar..."Truss Rod" deals with Bow or Arch of the Neck, String Tension and Buzz. I play pretty well, thousands more shred better than me, if you are starting out don't mess with the Truss Rod it can snap your neck. Sharp Frets meaning fret ends that aren't filed smootly...typical of budget guitars, you can live that.

Set Up has to do with your style, playing in tune with others and ease of playing. Don't worry about it. If you have some knick knack challenge's playing the guitar--HARD really Hard to fret notes, extreme pain while playing, chances are a pro can work out some of those kinks on the guitar for a little bit of money...rattles, buzzes won't stay in tune...sometimes it is a minor adjustment in the "Set Up" think of it as adjusting the seats/mirror in your car after someone else has driven it. If you don't drive, IMAGINE Shaquille O'Neal (He's 7'4") driving your car--He would have to adjust the mirror's differently than you right? I'm 6'0 and I would want Mr. O'Neal to adjust the mirrors etc. so he could see properly? So he doesn't wreck right?

I have a 1981 Gibson Les Paul Custom which is for me; My main Guitar. It plays like butter it is so smooth, easy to fret, gets better with age. When I bought my Squire I had it outfitted with EMG pickups, (orig. Fender pickups had a nasty buzz...we do a lot of recording and the EMG'S offer great noise free tone for recording or live) a Floyd Rose Tremolo and Chuck Levin's did not want to take the $400 parts/adjustments I prescribed on as a job. I paid cash and said: "I am serious...for my $390 Squire." They did it and it is one truly smooth playing great sounding Strats ever.

Your style will develop, your taste etc. so in the beginning you may ask them to work out any buzzes, keep the action fairly low and easier for me to play the thing. An accomplished tech has heard that a 1,000 times! I tell them: Just about to buzz then raise it a hair. When you purchase the guitar ask them, they will help you, if they don't maybe you should purchase elsewhere? Buying Used--different game! When I teach I offer going to the store with the less experienced to assist them, maybe you know someone you can do that with! Good Luck, I know I was wordy, hopefully I helped...I don't know you although if want to talk via phone I would be happy to speak with you let me know...if your'e under 18 get permission form Mom and Dad. I am a Dad with three kids, my prints are on file with the FBI because I teach! NO Worry, I just like to help!

When I take a younger player to the store I get to run through amps etc. Nothing cooler than Standing in front of Marshall/Boogie stacks with a Les Paul and cranking it out...I live vicariously through the player and I don't invest the cash; although, I get to hear what I want to buy when I buy...the key again is: "What Style of Music Are You Looking to Play?" (By the way I am a Boogie fanatic)

Thanks for asking, thanks for reading, Hope I helped? Feel free to keep communicating!

[allthumbs]

I'd have to respectfully disagree with you about the need for truss rod adjustments. Lower end guitars are rarely set up at the factory. The action tends to be set high at the factory and the strings tend to be cheap. They are often changed to a higher or lower gauge by the player in short order. Our resident guitar tech, Ultimate Garage Band, has a guitar store and one of the first things he does is adjust the truss rod.
Many times we have had members complaining of string buzz after changing to lighter strings. UGBs answer was usually adjust the truss rod which fixed the problem almost every time. I know my Washburn Folk had to have the relief changed right out of the box to maximize it for finger style.

[zeater41]

Originally Posted by allthumbs

I'd have to respectfully disagree with you about the need for truss rod adjustments. Lower end guitars are rarely set up at the factory. The action tends to be set high at the factory and the strings tend to be cheap. They are often changed to a higher or lower gauge by the player in short order. Our resident guitar tech, Ultimate Garage Band, has a guitar store and one of the first things he does is adjust the truss rod.
Many times we have had members complaining of string buzz after changing to lighter strings. UGBs answer was usually adjust the truss rod which fixed the problem almost every time. I know my Washburn Folk had to have the relief changed right out of the box to maximize it for finger style.

Cool! Having never really bought low end...I guess what I am saying is unqualified folks shouldn't mess with it you know? Nice point....

[Stratrat]

I was actually very surprised today - I read UGB's threads on truss rod adjustment and intonation setup and set about doing a setup on my Squier 51. Using his method, I discovered that the action was set perfect and the truss rod needed no adjustment whatsoever. The intonation was way off, but that was simple enough to get in the ballpark - nothing more than a screwdriver, a tuner and 15 or so minutes of my time.

[zeater41]

Originally Posted by Stratrat

I was actually very surprised today - I read UGB's threads on truss rod adjustment and intonation setup and set about doing a setup on my Squier 51. Using his method, I discovered that the action was set perfect and the truss rod needed no adjustment whatsoever. The intonation was way off, but that was simple enough to get in the ballpark - nothing more than a screwdriver, a tuner and 15 or so minutes of my time.

Very Cool...I was also surprised. These Forums sometimes become; silly, whatever you want to call it? One-Upsmanship? Depending on where you are in your guitar quest...I believe in the beginning the truss rod is deep doo-doo for beginners...Heck I've been playing for over 20 years and I leave it to the Pros. (The Pros I use; have a passion for guitar and never mislead for dollars...TRUST ay?) If you have no idea or knack for it you can do more damage than good.

I Beleive in; K.I.S.S. Keep it simple "silly" Since I have not experienced a "51" they intrigue me though? You in my opinion did exactly what all the techs I know would have done...screwdriver, tuner, good ear and some patience to get it right! Awesome...Rock On!

[zeater41]

Originally Posted by Stratrat

I was actually very surprised today - I read UGB's threads on truss rod adjustment and intonation setup and set about doing a setup on my Squier 51. Using his method, I discovered that the action was set perfect and the truss rod needed no adjustment whatsoever. The intonation was way off, but that was simple enough to get in the ballpark - nothing more than a screwdriver, a tuner and 15 or so minutes of my time.

How is your "51"? What do you play it through? Describe how you feel about it? $99...Hard to wrong...Does it stay in Tune? Have any Tele quality to it?

[allthumbs]

Congrats. Fender is blowing the 51s out the door for 99 bucks so they have a clear field when they introduce the new 51. They are addressing the erratic quality control of the present 51s and will probably upgrade the hardware. Bottom line is that the new 51s will have better quality, but they won't be the bang for the buck bargains they are now.

[Stratrat]

Not meaning to hijack the thread, but here's my .02 on your questions:

Originally Posted by zeater41

How is your "51"?

I seem to have gotten a decent one. Body finish is flawless, no chips, dings or scratches anywhere. It's a sunberst finish and appears to be a 4-piece body. The grain isn't perfectly matched from piece to piece, but the appearance isn't objectionable in any way. The neck is maple with a "skunk stripe" up the back and a laminated birds-eye maple fretboard. Neck pocket is tight, and there were no loose or missing screws/hardware. The tuners actually feel better than the ones on my MIM Strat. No noise from any of the electronics/controls, and all seem to work well. The single-coil neck pickup is aligned perfectly beneath the strings, while the HB at the bridge is offset slightly toward the bottom of the guitar, to the point where the high 'E' string is positioned at the inside edge of the pickup magnet - the only real fault I can find so far.

Originally Posted by zeater41

What do you play it through?

I play through a Fender Blues Jr. or a Roland Microcube. Effects are Digitech RP-80>Boss OD-3>Danelectro Fab Chorus>Danelectro PB&J delay>amp. I play classic rock, country and blues (but none of them well - lol!)

Originally Posted by zeater41

Describe how you feel about it? $99...Hard to wrong...

The latter sentence pretty well sums it up. Overall I'm very satisfied with it. I'm not a gigging guitarist (still have a ways to go before I reach that point!), and don't have a high-end/high-dollar setup. To be honest, I doubt that I'd sound or play any better through a $2500 guitar than I do through a $99 one. My main reasons for buying the '51 were: 1)GAS; 2)It got pretty good reviews and looked like good bang for the buck; and 3)At that price point, I'm not afraid to mess with it - I figured it would be a good tinkering/project guitar.

Originally Posted by zeater41

Does it stay in Tune?

The strings it came with were brand-new, judging by the look, feel and sound - so it stays in tune as well as any axe with new strings on it. They've stabilized since I stretched them, but don't stay in tune any better or worse than any of my other guitars.

Originally Posted by zeater41

Have any Tele quality to it?

Yep. In the middle position (neck/HB) with the HB tapped/split, it has a passable Tele sound to it - not quite as twangy as a real Tele, but a reasonable facsimile. It has a definite Strat sound at the neck pickup, and a pretty good growl through the HB.

[zeater41]

Originally Posted by hb

Forgive my limited knowledge in electrics as I have never owned one and am trying to gain some knowledge in this before buying. Can a guitar with a "combination humbucker" resemble a tele in it's sound?
thanks,
hb

Combination meaning there maybe two different types of pick ups on the guitar...single coil or humbuckers. There are lipstick tubes, and gibson's version of the single coil called a P90. Slightly smaller than a humbucker bigger than single coil. Single coil most closely associated with Fenders, Humbuckers mostly with Gibson. Having said that: Teles have their own voiced single coiled pick ups. In general a Tele pick up does not fit on a Strat without modification to the body. A Strat pick up may fit a Tele although why not just go with a Strat. In my opinion the Tele is a Tele for a reason and it is a formidable guitar that can stand alone for many styles of music! So what's holding you back now? Versatile Guitar Lots of Uses, Styles not to be confused with the Strat. There are sounds on the Tele you can not get with a Strat. You can get some Strat sound from a Tele though.